PIE-EATER
17 May 2018
Re: Hmmmmn Oh, and I'm not the one with 9% of my holdings in a fund that I don't like and won't sell...
PIE-EATER
17 May 2018
Re: Hmmmmn No.....the basis is that we disagree fundamentally perhaps because you can't actually read the facts in a post and don't understand where you are deliberately misinterpreting or plain wrong.........but no doubt being child-like you will want the last word.
marktime1231
17 May 2018
Re: Hmmmmn Delighted to end the conversation here on the basis I am right and you are wrong, and good luck.
PIE-EATER
17 May 2018
Re: Hmmmmn MTI said over 5 years OR SO.... trying to second guess when I actually bought it and predict what my returns have been is naive at best. My initial and significant purchases were in Nov 2012 in the low hundred and teens.....so that gives me 60p+ capital gain in about 5 1/2 years......plus divis as you say. So I think my off the cuff figure was pretty close and possibly even underestimated performance.Volatility...there is always going to be volatility, even for a Morningstar 5* rated fund.....it is just how much n comparison to the rest of a portfolio.We each have our own way of looking at things. Yes, I COULD buy an annuity, but that presumes my life expectancy is around or better than the projected average otherwise the annuity provider wins hands down...and I have foregone all the capital.....great idea when I can use my SIPP to pass things on IHT free!Why have you now changed to quoting EAT? If you believe it is so good (and I have held it for long periods and welcome the recent share split) why is that not 9% or more of your holdings and why more importantly are you still holding SIGT? You are obviously very underwhelmed by SIGT so SELL. Also don't forget that a significant proportion of that 6.5% from EAT is actually capital return, not income....so that could equally well be EGIT (European Growth and Income Trust). Yes it has done slightly better than SIGT, as you would expect being in equities and smaller ones at that, but the exchange rate is virtually that same as 5 years ago.You refer to the job SIGT has done vs SMT and the need for income stocks. I make no such argument. Defensive proxies for bonds have their place...eg NG. Stocks that are growing their dividend also have their place. I rarely have pure growth stocks, perhaps the 2 closest are BREE and GBG.....which are also serving a specific purpose.You TELL me to think again. Well thank you for that instruction. In the same way that I have no idea of your experience / capabilities/ age / personal situation, you do not know mine. As usual I will continue to regularly review and amend as I see fit. I have different holdings in my portfolio for various reasons. They are not all like EAT or SMT, nor are they all like SIGT. The intention is to make a "team" out of the holdings to get me to my objectives on time and by minimising volatility. I have no great desire to tempt fate but I am not complaining.One thing I did underestimate was the objective. I said (off the cuff again) that it was base rate plus 6% when in actual fact it is inflation plus 6%.....I can live with that for this part of my portfolioI believe that concludes this discussion point.PE
marktime1231
17 May 2018
Re: Hmmmmn Good luckThe SIGT low over 5 years is 121p vs a high of 179p, so the very best growth excluding dividend you could have had is 48%. 5 years of compound 3.7% income gets you another 20%. So if you had perfect timing the outcome is +68%. Today the price of 176p gives you +66%. FETrustnet says a risk score of 48, cf a score of 100 for the FTSE100. Recent performance has shown SIGT is still volatile, vulnerable to the return of inflation and rising interest rates and institutions trying to cancel preference shares.In contrast EAT has grown from 813p to a peak of 1310p so growth of 61% plus 6.5% compound divdends gets us to a maximum return of +98%. Today the price is equivalent 1230p no thanks to stronger GBP:EUR so +89% total return. Considering EAT is the biggest component of SIGT why not just hold it directly? All you are doing is paying SIGT to dilute performance. FETrustnet says a risk score of 82. The "job" it has done vs SMT's return of 318% over the same period plays to the argument of those who say there is no need to ever hold income stocks. FETrustnet risk score 164. Well if the I in SIGT is only 3.7% there is no point, it is not doing you a good income "job", you could buy an annuity for better income and zero risk. Whereas 6.5% from EAT is top of the tree.The EAT outlook would benefit from growth in Euro small and mid caps plus a favourable swing in EUR:GBP. SIGT moving away from equities is dampening its own outlook, being set in low yield fixed income makes it vulnerable to rising gilts, the only glimmer on the horizon is the mooted float of AJBell which would give a boost if the stock debuts well ahead of current book valuation.So when I say Good Luck what I mean is Think Again.
PIE-EATER
17 May 2018
Re: Hmmmmn MTLikewise, quite happy to disagree We don't all have the same timeframes and priorities.This does a job for me.......as part of one overall asset allocation (not an income or a growth portfolio) and over the last 5 years or so it as returned about 70% with low volatility as part of my core holding. For me, as I approached retirement, that was a very nice counter investment to the likes of SMT, BGS, JEO, AIF, FGT etc....which have all done well but have all had interesting "moments" - as expected. It has given me dependability without the extreme fluctuations that other holdings have. Bond funds per se have never been my forte...or anything approaching Good luck with what you decide to do - I will continue to hold.PE
marktime1231
16 May 2018
Re: Hmmmmn Quite happy to disagree with you, although I am not so sure why you are so keen to defend mediocrity. I asked for good arguments in SIGT favour and the basis of a positive outlook and am getting neither.Morningstar list the ytd performance of the top holdings, BT stands out as a dog. EAT is a bigger holding and is slightly down but delivers high income, why not hold it directly, ditto SMIF, and what else is a recommended pick for either income or growth? What is in SIGT that is good and only available in SIGT and so worth paying their high charges for?Yes I want better than 3.7% income and flat growth over 12 months, don't you? Management describe things as disappointing but in touch with their benchmarks. Fees are too high for that result. Hardly a temporary bad patch, and I am still wondering where the good news is going to come from.I can't believe you think you are either having your cake or eating it, with respect you are easily pleased if this is what you consider a good income or a good growth investment, it is certainly not both. Nor was it immune to recent volatility.FWIW my two income portfolios in stocks and trusts respectively are delivering running yields of 5.6% and 5.8% and are both 2-3% ahead for the year. My growth trusts and value stocks portfolios are 6% and 1.5% (no thanks to a plunge in CRST today) ahead ytd. Not including about 2% dividends pending payment. Follow my posts if you are really interested to see where. ps this is despite (for now) a top four holding so about 9% in SIGT which is -ve return ytd, eg cash has done better. Conclusion forming is that if SIGT can't do better then maybe it is time to move on.
PIE-EATER
16 May 2018
Re: Hmmmmn A couple of questions...1) Where did you get the BT info from? (you say cost it most on a 20% drop...how big was the holding? ) TBH...the last info I saw was a few days ago and at the end of March BT was nowhere to be seen in major holdings but was 1.5% at end April so almost certainly added after the drop - a bit perplexed at your comment. The largest direct uk holding was only 1.6% of the fund and it wasn't in the top 5 so couldn't have cost more than 0.3%2)What are you referring to as the benign benchmark? For a low volatility multi-asset portfolio I would be quite happy with base rate plus 6% after fees.Respectfully suggesting that you are wanting your cake and eat it.....yes, I have Shin Nippon as a holding giving 40% return pa of late......but it has been very volatile at times. I have RUSP giving a massive yield but every time Trump and Putin look at each other it plummets. This is the nearest thing you are going to get to a diversified widows and orphans fund within the IT sector at the moment which pays a palatable sustainable dividend.PE
marktime1231
16 May 2018
Re: Hmmmmn A bad bet on BT has cost it most where a 20% drop is one way to reduce exposure to stocks I suppose, but for a professional trust and stock picker there should be many more good bets than bad. SIGT includes some of the under-performers held directly in my own portfolio, but at least those deliver better than 3.7% yield while waiting for an upswing.The net difference is the charges which are unjustified on this performance. It is measuring itself against benign benchmarks but paying itself table-topping fees. More than a change of manager is required.Holding on for improvement but not sure where that might be coming from.
PIE-EATER
16 May 2018
Re: Hmmmmn Hopefully you will have noted both a change in the team (Alan Borrows retired) and prior to that the stated intention to reduce equity exposure prior to an expected downturn in equities in 2019. Yes, it's charges are comparatively high....but does over diversification.Also, it doesn't just hold funds.PE
marktime1231
15 May 2018
Hmmmmn SIGT announces the dividend will be increased so we will be back to a 3.7% yield, and I can hardly be bothered to summon a yawn. What is in the portfolio or in the charges which is holding this trust-of-trusts back? Is there something to look forward to?
PIE-EATER
29 Dec 2017
Re: problems dealing SIGT Thanks MMI agree with all your comments and have spoken to each of the brokers / platforms (sometimes repeatedly and at length over the last couple of days). I DO know they have all the correct details but I suspect with MiFID 2 being at the forefront of the minds and ensuring clients are aware what they are investing in, they have decided to update everything which may not have been updated for the last 3,4 or 5 years.I had no corporate pension provision until I was in my mid thirties so when A-Day came about in 2006 I jumped in (I was a pension trustee by then) You say...Sadly, we are all in the hands of our brokers as to whether they have interrupted the requirements correctly; then we as their clients have ultimately little choice to supply what is asked for, otherwise you cannot deal....Oh how true! Ultimately this will weed out those who have little understanding of what they are doing but it will also drive away people because of the interference of "big brother"......and I will probably fall into the latter category with some of my providers....(SIPPs ISAs and being a Trustee on a couple of Will Trust Accounts mean I have a wide exposure to providers at the minute)Thanks again for your thoughtsPE
Medway Man
29 Dec 2017
Re: problems dealing SIGT Perhaps it might be worth giving the people you use, a call.........? Could be that when you opened an account with your brokers the information supplied was not enough, at that time? Again is it because you what you are trading within; a SIPP, ISA or both ?Personally I cannot comment on a SIP, as both my wife and I worked for banks for far to many years each, and were fortunate to be in great non contributory final salary schemes.If I recall correctly, that when Equiniti took over Selftrade and changed the name to Equiniti Selftrade, we had to provide a lot more personal info than had been previously supplied.Sadly, we are all in the hands of our brokers as to whether they have interrupted the requirements correctly; then we as their clients have ultimately little choice to supply what is asked for, otherwise you cannot deal.
PIE-EATER
29 Dec 2017
Re: problems dealing SIGT Now being sent bucket loads of forms for complex instruments.....different providers, for regular SIPP investment into ITs, also kids ISAs in ITs......oh joy!The world is rapidly going mad. I don't have an issue regarding ensuring people understanding what they are investing in but these questionnaires include things I would never touch as well as mainstream ITs.PE
PIE-EATER
29 Dec 2017
Re: problems dealing SIGT Thanks....would say the platforms I use have been decent in the aspects you mention - no complaints there. Just can't get my head round ITs and KIIDs as I don't think they have them and they are listed securities, so I thought they were exempt from this requirement
